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Young Global Leaders
Need a dose of hope? Listen to these conversations with inspiring young people from around the world.
If you want to hear what forging common ground looks like in practice, look no further.
I met these youngsters during the 2024-25 academic year, when I was Dean of Baret Scholars, a global gap year program with around 100 students from 40+ countries. We traveled together to seven global regions over the course of 8 1/2 months, during which they formed a tight-knit, loving community, grounded in the certainty that we collectively create a better future for all. They've generously agreed to let me interview them, so that their wisdom, optimism, and brilliance can shine forth for everyone's benefit.
You'll hear terms like "morning program," "afternoon options," "fellows," "fellowships," etc. These refer to different design elements of the program. The details don't matter; you'll be able to get the basic meaning from context.
Enjoy!
Young Global Leaders
Nico Zamora
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This episode, we're joined by Nico Zamora.
Follow Nico on Instagram @_nicozamorag, at on LinkedIn here.
Here are some highlights from our delightful conversation:
- Curiosity Over Fear: Nico defines himself by his curiosity, which consistently pushes him to explore the unknown despite natural feelings of fear or isolation.
- Language and Emotion: He highlights how Spanish captures love with more nuance than English, distinguishing between the profound "Te amo" and the caring "Te quiero."
- Rejecting Rigid Timelines: His global travels helped him unlearn the idea that life, education, and careers must follow a strict, predefined structure to be successful.
- Cross-Cultural Communication: Nico approaches cultural differences by remembering our shared humanity and underlying desire for happiness.
- De-escalating Differences: To communicate effectively across cultures, he relies on smiling, lowering his voice, and actively listening so others do not feel attacked or threatened.
Future Plans & Finding Hope:
- Summer Work: He is returning to Bolivia to work at a mental health and addiction center alongside a psychiatrist who originally inspired his interest in neuroscience.
- Studying Abroad: He plans to study art, history, and theater in London to broaden his perspective and connect artistic human expression back to behavioral neuroscience.
- Spreading Hope: Niko stays hopeful by finding beauty in small moments, specifically the simple act of smiling at strangers and sharing positive daily interactions.
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Hello and welcome to Young Global Leaders, where we get the chance to hear from young people hailing from all around the world, sharing about themselves, their accomplishments, and their vision for a better world. Recently, I had the privilege of leading a group of about 100 young people from over 40 countries to seven global regions on an eight-month global gap year program. Most of them had just graduated from high school, though we also had a few older students. During our eight-plus months together, the students formed a deeply loving and supportive community. Anyone could see that they had built something unique and inspiring. Through my eyes as a teacher, coach, and global leadership consultant, what I saw was unlike anything I'd seen before. When the program ended, I desperately wanted to keep in touch with these students and to share their example with the world. So I started the Young Global Leaders podcast. Today we hear from Nico Zamora. Nico Samora, welcome. Thank you for joining us.
SPEAKER_01Thank you. Thank you for the invitation. I'm very excited to talk to you.
SPEAKER_00Yeah, I'm excited to talk to you too. Can you start by sharing with our listeners where you're joining us from today and what has brought you there?
SPEAKER_01So I'm right now in Canton, in the state of New York, upstate New York in the US. I'm studying here. I'm in the university, in St. Lawrence University, actually with a couple couple of people from the program that we had the chance to do with you. Basically, I think the reason I ended up here was that I wanted to pursue neuroscience. And when I was looking into colleges and all of the opportunities that they offered, this was one of the schools that uh caught my attention. And I also got to meet the international recruiter before I applied. And well, after I had applied, actually. And he had seen my interview and he was like, hey, I I checked what you said. And then we had a chat, and he he really convinced me that this was a great option. So yeah, as time passed, I was more convinced, and now I'm here.
SPEAKER_00Excellent. So they've got a good undergraduate in neuroscience program at St. Lawrence?
SPEAKER_01Yes, yes. Apparently, also, according to the Princeton Review, and I don't know how accurate that is. It also has like, I think it's the number eight lab facilities, which in my experience, they have been pretty good. I don't know, like I don't have any other idea to compare it to other universities, but I'm very happy with all of the facilities they have.
SPEAKER_00Is that what you're so are you majoring in neuroscience? Is that your major?
SPEAKER_01Yeah, so far, yes. Uh it's it's liberal arts, right? So um I haven't decided or like officially stated what will what I'm gonna major on, but that's the plan. Neuroscience is the plan.
SPEAKER_00Aaron Powell Excellent. Good. Um I've always had a little bit of envy of neuroscience just be it's because it's such a fascinating subject and it's also it's closely related to my interest of linguistics and cognition generally, but just at a completely different level.
SPEAKER_01Um what I find fascinating. What I find fascinating about neuroscience is that you can basically link most of the fields of knowledge and back to the brain and back to how it's a structure and how it functions. So I think that's what I'm interested about mainly. Like choose my interest towards neuroscience has come from so many different places places that I think whatever you do, neuroscience is it's could be interesting to look at to fully understand the picture of things.
SPEAKER_00Absolutely. And it's it's actually, you know, in um I can't remember. I think I probably introduced a couple of really basic neuroscience concepts in some of the work that we did with Bray Scholars, you know, because it ties so closely together with intercultural leadership and communication and all of that.
SPEAKER_03Yeah.
SPEAKER_00And all I can basically get to is like, okay, yes, the amygdala is our threat detection, threat detection mechanism, and we've got the neocorte. It's so much more complicated. So if anybody ever asks me a question that goes beyond the basics, I would have nothing to say other than I don't know.
SPEAKER_01So it's helpful. I think I'm way lower than your level yet. I haven't taken any neuroscience course yet. So but I'm very excited. I'm very looking forward to that. Because every time I read about it, I'm just so, so intrigued. It's so interesting.
SPEAKER_00Well, if if it is true that you know less about neuroscience than me right now, on day one of your first neuroscience class, you will surpass my level of knowledge of neuroscience.
SPEAKER_01It's next semester.
SPEAKER_00Next semester. I'll come back to you. Okay, sounds good. Uh all right, Nico, I'm gonna ask you the question I ask everybody, which is what makes you you?
SPEAKER_01Oh, this is this is actually such a good question, but I think it's so hard to answer. Um, I was thinking about it, and I think the first thing that came to my mind was a word to describe myself. And if I had to choose a word, I would use curiosity. Because I feel like most of my life has been determined about just a sense of unease. Because there's there's something that I don't know, and that's never gonna change. Like all of my life I'm gonna go through not knowing something. Um and I think that's just that's just shaped the decisions I made and has helped me to take to make decisions and to decide things throughout. But when it came to friendships, when it came to family and the things that I like, even hobbies, I've always like tried to to change and to move around and to learn new things and to just basically experience as much as I could because I I always felt like this sense of there's something that I don't know, so how can I discover that? Um yeah, and I think at some point that just got super overwhelmed, overwhelming to like not knowing everything and a sense of frustration towards that, and knowing that I'm not able to know everything. And I guess that's translated a little bit into art. Um, and art has become like my way of exploring that curiosity. So to do things, and well, of course, with Barrett and having gone to Armenia to finish high school, far from Bolivia, literally far from Bolivia, and living two years there, then traveling with the Gabier program that we did with Barrett throughout the world, and then coming here. That sense of that I'm never gonna get to know everything keeps me moving and keeps me putting it puts me in places that I've never been and in situations that I've never faced. So curiosity would be a great way of defining me, and and I think curiosity makes me me. But I also thought about love because I I also believe that love can be entirely the whole truth. Uh, there's everything it has, like it's yin and yang, good and bad. Uh and I think love comes with suffering too. And I think it's important to recognize that suffering exists before love, to understand that love is important. But who who are you if you don't have a community, if you don't have people to love, if you don't have things that you love to do. So I would say that love is also something that makes me me.
SPEAKER_00Thank you so much for sharing that. I uh this may you know, this may be something that you've noticed about culture here in the United States, broadly speaking. This is this is my opinion, but that we're we're we're we don't talk about love very much here. Um it's almost like it's a there's a certain amount of shame that's attached to even to even talking about love. We even have you have you heard, you know, the L word? People will talk about the L word. Like almost like love is like a yeah, like a almost like a F-word, right? It's like it's like it's a swear word or something that we can't even that we can't even talk about. So I I really appreciate the uh the openness with which you share about the importance of love to you.
SPEAKER_01Thank you. You know what's also super interesting? I think love is is very different to like I understand love different in English than I do it in Spanish. Because I feel like you in in and you like linguistics, probably you're familiarized with this um comparison. But in Spanish, we have two ways of addressing someone that you care about. And it could be through te quiero and te amo. Whereas in English you only have I love you. So I think that's also I think that's also part, right? Because when you only have one word to describe it, then you need to be very careful to use it. Um so I guess that also plays a role into what makes the L word the L word.
SPEAKER_00That's great. Okay, we're gonna get really nerdy here for a moment because I've been I've been working on Spanish on Duolingo now for about a year. Um I still it it's not functional. It's not even close to functional yet. But I would love to hear from you. What is the difference between te amo and tequiero?
SPEAKER_01Oh I think I think te amo, you you have to feel something big on you. Uh it has to Tequiero, you can just it's something that you that it's dear to you, that you wanna care about, that you that you don't want something bad to happen, I would say. When it comes I'm of course referring to person, exing a person as an example. And te amo, which is the direct translation uh uh to I love you. Um I think it's more of a profound feeling of I would do anything for you. You know, you don't you don't you don't die for someone that you only quieres that because the translation to te quiero is I want you. But which is not the same connotation, right? When you say it in Spanish, it's it's very complex to like really translate it directly. Um Wow, I think it's a very hard question to answer.
SPEAKER_02I didn't mean to put you on the spot.
SPEAKER_01I think you need to ex you need to understand Spanish to be able to understand the difference of those two words. Because I can like, of course, I can simplify it and say I love you, it's for your family, for your closest friends, um, for your significant other. But be more broadly used, right? Um but I think it's more than that. Because I also feel love towards so many things when I'm thinking in Spanish.
SPEAKER_00Thank you for guiding us through that. I mean, literally, I would bet probably you know a few hundred grad student papers in linguistics departments have been written about this topic, probably.
SPEAKER_01So I know, yes. Because and I think it's something that people, especially Spanish speakers that then went to to UWC, for example, people that I talked to in my UWC, they all had this, it was so hard to say I love you, because it felt that you needed to be so smart to use it. Like you couldn't express really your like how much you care about someone because it was only a word and you had to be careful. And you couldn't just accidentally say it to someone because it would have a very, very big connotation, which in Spanish wouldn't.
SPEAKER_00Okay. All right. Good. Well, I really appreciate you taking a deep dive there. Scratching my nerd itch. Well, the next question I've got for you is, you know, we'd love to hear more about your story and about your background and how you came to be a part of the Beret Scholars Program, which is what brought us together.
SPEAKER_01Um So yeah, I I'm from Bolivia. I'm from the south. Uh uh, it's a city in a valley that it's situated in a valley, beautiful city. Very close to the border. Tarija. It's very close to the border of Argentina, super close, two hours away. Um beautiful. I'm so happy that I was born there. And well, of course, I was uh the city is very isolating. You it's not really that we have a big um, well, Bolivia with the political situation, sometimes it's hard to really be interconnected. We're not really a very globalized country per se. It's something that is just happening in the past, I'm gonna say, months because there's been a change in government. Um so yeah, um I was very isolated, and I as I as I told you before, I've always felt this curiosity to something else. And the references that I had, of course, were from movies and stuff like that. So my idea was after I finished school, I'm gonna try to apply university in the US. I'll see what happens. Um, I was learning English and I was putting some effort on English. Uh so that was my plan. And then I had a friend that had gone to UWC, and he invited us to the talk that he had about UWC. He was going to do a webinar or something to explain what UWC was. And since he was close enough, I ended up going. And that year I couldn't apply. But since then, UWC was always in the back of my head. And then when time came around, it was COVID. I applied, I got in. And after I got in, I was maybe this is not for me, maybe this is not what I want to do. I was very, very scared. That's actually when I started a podcast. I also had a podcast back in the day where I talked about like some things, and literally the first episode that I've ever recorded was on fear. Um because it was like it was, it was more of a journal for myself in exploring what I was feeling, the things that I was thinking about. Um and then I I realized that the only way of actually putting myself out there was putting myself out there. And I was like, okay, I'm gonna go. I'm gonna go to Armenia. I didn't really know much about Armenia. I only knew that the alphabet was different. I I knew some other things, um, but nothing really relevant. You know, like it's not that I it's not a country that had gone through my mind a couple of times. Um, so I was very scared. Also, as a Bolivian, all of the issues with the visas and travel restrictions is something that um haunts you wherever you are. So, and I had I had a layover in Qatar and I had a layover in Brazil. Brazil was fine. Uh, but I was very scared. It was my first time uh flying over the sea, over the ocean. So of course I was scared. I was like, I was alone. I was 18 by then. Um that also played a role in why I didn't want to go, and I felt that it wasn't my place to do UWC when I was 18. Um, but yeah, I ended up going, everything went fine. I did a layover in Qatar, ended up in Armenia. I stepped out of the flight and I was like, wow, I don't understand. This is all in Armenian. Um I met in the airport some people that I know uh that I knew from like chatting and stuff. Um went to school. And since then, I think my life has been about changing what I think and deconstructing ideas and and learning so much because I realized that I lived in such a narrow mind sort of bubble, and like all of the things that I knew and all of the things that I could access to were very secluded. I needed to put so much effort if I really wanted to learn something else and do something else that wasn't offered easily around me. Um so it genuinely changed everything that the way I view life. I wanted to go back to Bolivia uh after UWC, but once I stepped in UWC, I I said to myself, I'm not going back, not at least for university. I really want to be out there and explore the world. And well then I wasn't planning on taking a gap year at all. Like it was not something that I ever thought about. Uh because first of all, in Bolivia, that's not something that people do. It's not very well seen. And second of all, also I was already 18 and I was going to finish univers uh UWC for when I was 20, and I thought that that was like a good age to start college. Like it was a little bit late, but it was time to start college. Um so then I had applied to universities, and in the process I came across Baret. I was actually in Turkey when I when I saw the opportunity of Baret. And in Turkey, I just realized, because I was living alone more or less, and I realized how much the world has to offer and how small I am compared to everything that exists. And I that's when I started questioning why am I putting, why am I, why am I, why do I have to do things uh in a certain structure? Why do I have to go to a school and then finish at a certain age, and then go to university and finish a certain age, and then do a master's and finish at a certain age, and then start my life. You know, that it's more or less how you live in Bolivia. And I was, I already, I already stepped out of that cycle. I need to try something more. Then I read the book, I had a call with um Khaledi. I that was the first person that I've ever connected with. Um, and then I was like, yeah, I'm gonna try this. I didn't tell my parents when I was applying, uh, because I knew that they were going to be, they were going to push back on the idea. Um, and I also, to be honest, didn't know how likely it was what how high my chances were to apply. So I wanted to keep it for myself. I applied, I had interviews, um, and then I ended up getting in, and that's when I told my parents. And my parents in the beginning said, no, I don't like I think it's time for you to go to university. My mom was very scared that I wasn't going to go to university after the gap year. She was like, maybe you change your mind. Maybe that's not what you want afterwards. Um, but I was sure that university was something that I wanted to do. That's why I also really wanted to do Varet. Um, so yeah, in the end I did Baret, and it was generally one of the best things, one of the best decisions I've ever made. And now that I look back at it, TH means nothing against all of the experiences that I've had and all of the things that I've seen and everything that I've done so far.
SPEAKER_00Wow. Uh there's a number of things that are wonderful story, Nico. I appreciate you sharing it. Um I guess the first thing that's striking me about it is just how strong your curiosity is, because it seems like there are there are so many times, so many points in that story where fear could have kept you from following the path that you ended up following. And it was it seems like it was always curiosity pulling you, pulling you, pulling you, pulling you, and how whatever fear may or may not have been there was not strong enough to counter the curiosity. Does that does that feel accurate to you?
SPEAKER_01Yes, I think I think you said it right. Um just being curious about what was going to happen if I made that decision, if I went there, if I applied, if I has always been um like my motor. And and of course, fear, even like when it comes to rejection, right? Like you can be rejected from so many things. Um but I realized that that's part of life. And in the end, to be honest, I've been lucky enough to experience the things that my heart really like wanted to, and the things that I put effort and patience and love towards have always brought me back so many good results. Uh so curiosity has also like very much tied to the love that you put into doing things. Um yeah, yeah, I was lucky. I was I'm very lucky. I think I'm very lucky.
SPEAKER_00Okay, well, shifting gears a little bit, I wanted to ask you. Well, it's actually still on topic because it's connected to curiosity as well. But you know, we often talk about learning as an important outcome of a program like Bray Scholars. Can you share with us anything that you might have unlearned during your travels?
SPEAKER_02Oh, yes.
SPEAKER_01Um I don't think I've been ever a person who with many prejudices. Um, I do believe that I've been lucky enough to experience things while growing up that allow me to um develop a sense of empathy that was uh strong enough to be able to to see everything on people, the good and the bad, and and move around. And then of course UWC enhance the uh those those beliefs and and allow me always to to to talk to people and to and you know like wait, can I re can can I repeat can I do it again? This one? Yes, start over. Okay, yeah. Um I know what I wanted to say. Um give you two seconds. I need to order my uh put some order in my head. Um yeah, okay, something that I really learned through Albert, um, that I think that I somehow mentioned it while I was talking to you about um how things end up ended up being in my life and the decisions that I made, and it was about the structure. Um and to be honest, it's something that I'm still thinking of, and it's in the back of my head, the idea that there are certain things that society, your family, and the people around you expect to do, expect you to do. Um and I'm not gonna lie, like growing up and before I went to UWC, and when I got into UWC, I've always received a lot of pushback from friends, some members of my family saying, You're gonna repeat two years of high school. Are you sure you wanna do that? Why don't you go just straight to college? Why would you take a gap year? You already took two gap years. Um, you know, of course, and I never received so much pushback. Um just talking to the people and being exposed to so many professionals from so many different careers, I think. Allowed me to understand that there's not a structure that determines success, happiness, or or anything really. There's not a single way of living and experiencing life. And I think even though I could understand that that was a thing before Barret, I think Barret just pushed me to understand that it actually nothing determines anything. And only you are the owner of the things you do. So you do the things that you want to do because you want to do them. And I think that's helped me a lot. Since I'm in university, after have experienced Baret, and even throughout Barret, while I was learning and trying to just use this philosophy in more of a daily basis, I grew so much. And I started doing the things that I wanted to do and saying the things that I wanted to do and thinking the way that I wanted to think and questioning more what I was thinking and why I was thinking. So in a way, I think it it destroyed many mental sets that I used to have and ways of thinking that I used to have and allowed me to actually put them into practice and not only like knowing them. Um aside from all of the knowledge that all of the speakers have brought to us. So yeah, I think that was the biggest take.
SPEAKER_00Yeah, it feels like it's it feels like it's uh it's a it's a continuation of a process that you described um in the previous question and about how you how you came to participate in the Bray Scholars program. It seems to me, you know, you're you're part one of the uh I guess outgrowths of your curiosity is a skepticism of these fixed ways of doing things. And you're drawn towards the possibilities, like what becomes possible when you question those and don't just follow the path that has been built for you. And it's like that that's a process that has been alive in you for a really long time. And it sounds to me like with Beret, it just hit it hit a new level. Um It really did.
SPEAKER_01It really did. Well, just seeing everything that we saw, right? And seeing so many opportunities and possibilities. Um, because before that, I've only gone to only so many countries and really as a tourist, you know, like you visit some places, the touristic places. Um in Armenia, I was living in Dilijan, so I saw it was a very small uh town. I saw the same buildings, the same people, the same dynamics, and just participating in Baret and seeing like having a monk and then an entrepreneur, and then so many, so, so many paths and so many possibilities that it I was just yeah, like I'm the owner of this, and I can do of my life whatever I want to. Um so it just like showed me face to face what actually life can look like, and that's it can look so different, and that's the beauty of it, that you decide how you want it to look. Nice.
SPEAKER_00Well, turning our attention now to after the program, like immediately after the program. So it is today's February 13th, 2026. Um so it's been now almost nine months. Actually, it's been eight and a half months. It's been like if you if you take the start date of beret to the end and the end date of beret to now, that second time period is actually now longer. So we've been we've been away from beret now longer than the actual. I just realized that myself.
SPEAKER_01Yeah, of course. Yeah.
SPEAKER_00Wow. Wow.
SPEAKER_01A year ago we were in in Nairobi, no? Yes.
SPEAKER_00We had just arrived in Nairobi. Oh Nairobi.
SPEAKER_01Nairobi is so I miss. I think I think I was in Carnivore actually one year ago in the restaurant. I miss it so much.
SPEAKER_00I do too much. We really do. Yeah, slice of heaven. Wonderful.
SPEAKER_01Yes.
SPEAKER_00Well, the question I'm gonna ask you is so right after the program, the program just ended, and then there's this process that we call re-entry, which looks different for everybody. And I'm wondering how that looked for you.
SPEAKER_01Oh well, to be honest, once I finished Barrett, I thought to myself, maybe my mom was right. Maybe I don't want to go to college anymore. Um, it took me a long time to understand life again and where I wanted to see myself and what I wanted to do. Not because I was confused, but because I had seen all of these possibilities, right? It was not a lack of, it was not that I was uh lost because I didn't know what to do, but it was because I wanted to do so much. Um So I was lost in trying to understand if the path that I had decided from before, which was college, was what I wanted, or should I consider other possibilities? Um I went back to Bolivia. That's what I did right after Bared. And going back to home, uh especially after all of the conversations I had and the things I've seen was a bit tough. Um not having friends that I've seen reinvented in every single country over and over again was not something that I was seeing anymore. I wasn't talking to the people, I wasn't, I wasn't comparing experiences. Um I was with my family, I was with my friends. Beautiful. I I I love spending time with them. But the city, the country, the dynamic of the country, the dynamic of the people felt that didn't belong with me anymore, that I wasn't really fitting into it. So I was very uncomfortable. Uh in the beginning, I didn't realize that that came from not because I was very lost, I was just very scared that Barrett had just changed my mind so much. But I took some time to reflect on the opportunity. And what I really realized is that maybe I don't feel that I fit anymore, but that's because I've been privileged enough to have experience what I've experienced. Um and I think that slowly like integrating that to the way I taught had allowed me to re-enter society, no? And like in a matter of a couple of weeks, I was talking to my friends as if nothing happened, as if nothing happened. I was again in the in the dynamic of I want to visit my grandma, I was going to do groceries, I was doing this and that. And it felt like I was part of it again. Uh, but you know, I always I'm always curious. Like that the curiosity is never gonna go away. So I, of course, I wanted to leave. And then um, I under that neuroscience is something that I really wanted to pursue, and it's an interest that had grown on me since years and years ago and has just it developed to neuroscience, but it had like a very interesting path towards the to the point that it it was neuroscience. So I was sure that I wanted to do it and I was like, I'm gonna I'm gonna do it. Um and yeah, then I came. And here in university, I feel like what was a bit uh rough was that the US was in a very specific state. Um the cold, those things played against rather than like the Baret experience, because I think I had integrated that uh back home, which was very helpful to take some time after Baret in my city to process everything that had happened.
SPEAKER_00Wow, so you know, one thing that is um that's coming through to me as you you narrate these different chapters of your life is that it's not just uh your curiosity and your courage, but you also seem to have a really strong kind of inner compass and wisdom. Like but you need to go through a process to arrive at a direction, and it's a process of just you know honest uh reflection. So also great insight too. So uh yeah, which I guess connects with the with the wisdom. You just you just seem to be open to an honest assessment of where you are, what you want know that you want to accomplish in the world, what constraints are around you, what opportunities are there, and you go through a process where that all just churns inside of you, and then you know what you want to do, and then you do it.
SPEAKER_01Yeah, I think I think I was, as I said, thank you first of all for the description. I really appreciate those words. Um Yeah, I've been lucky enough from since before I started my journey in the world to to be in touch with um various sectors of people. I did some work uh in a couple of programs. And I think just seeing also within Tarija different realities within my city, different realities and and different ways of living, aside from the one I was used to. Because usually you're very secluded to your bubble, right? Like you don't really see outside of there if if you don't force yourself to. And I was lucky enough to came across opportunities that allow me to see that. So I guess that self-reflection and self-exploration have come to from having seen so many people gone through so many things, uh, that allow me to dissect maybe what I was experiencing. Um I wouldn't say smarter, but just being more conscious of the things that were around me and my position in there and the privileges that I had, and how lucky and unlucky I was. Um and I think that's that's something that I I learned to do, and in a way it sticked to me throughout my life. And I guess all of these experiences have lifted that way more, no, like going to Armenia, then doing the then doing Barrett, and now with university, I I imagine also like seeing so many things. Um has a yeah, it just allows you to be able to dissect things uh from in a larger with more context, with more, with more information. So yeah.
SPEAKER_00Good, good. Next question I have for you is about uh relating across cultural differences. So traveling the world with peers from over 40 countries, you know a thing or two about how to communicate and collaborate effectively across cultures. What insights have you gained about this in uh you know, as a result of your experiences?
SPEAKER_01We're all humans, we're all trying to figure out, we all have fears, we all we all love, uh, we're all scared, we're all happy. We're all at the end of the day, just trying to go through life and trying to make the best out of it. Um, and I guess that philosophy helped me to engage in conversations in a way that I smile never was always part of those conversations, and always smiling at people gives you another perspective when it try when you're trying to communicate things that might be considered rough. But I don't think I've ever faced uh great difficulty uh communicating with people, and and maybe it's just because I haven't come across with a person that I wouldn't really be able to communicate properly, but so far um recognizing that there's differences is the first step. Um, and saying, I come from a certain context, you come from a certain context, we do not align in the way we think, maybe, we do not align in the way we we view life, but at least we're in the end of the day, we're both trying to do the same. We're trying to live, we're trying to be happy, we're trying to do the same things. So I'm gonna listen to you, I hope you listen to me, and that's how you engage in a productive conversation. To be honest, I think um I think the skills um that I gained the most from that, well, the way that I learned more about this sort of intercultural communication was through uh partners. I think partners really put you out there in having to face differences because you're gonna be very like if you if with a friend you feel that you can't communicate because you might be a little bit culturally different. With a partner, you're talking about someone that you spend your time that you because you build something with. So you're gonna you're gonna experience more rough paths. And I've been lucky enough to always find people uh that we're easy to talk to and and like come like to communicate. I think so. Yeah, just talk. Talking is very important. Just do it.
SPEAKER_00Just do it. I love it. Just do it. There's many different kinds of talking though, right? I mean, because we could there's also yelling and shouting is, I guess, is a form of.
SPEAKER_01You you don't you don't you don't shout. You try to lower your voice and have a a conversation where you listen to each other and no one feels attacked.
SPEAKER_00Right. And I think that that's the that's the distinction I'm picking up here is you know, the really kind of the default human condition is to feel attacked just by being in the presence of difference a lot of the time. Um and I think that that's what leads to a lot of difficulties in humans relating to each other successfully across differences because we see difference. The the part of the brain, here's my my neuroscience expertise coming out again, Nico. Please joking. You know, the amygdala gets active, and then we you know we can't think straight because we feel like somehow we are being challenged just by being in the presence of difference. But what I'm hearing you say is, and I think it's probably again your curiosity that's leading the way here, is there's no need to feel threatened. Right? It's it's just it's just a different way of going about our business. And there's a deeper level of commonality, which, oh, here's another little tiny little bit of neuroscience. Um, finding commonalities is uh is actually a brain management strategy for reducing the sense of threat. And that seems like that's just something that's also naturally a part of you, is is is knowing at a really deep level, this basic humanity that we all share.
SPEAKER_01Yes. And to be honest, I also, in a way, I got trained because when I was in Dilijan, I was part of the peer listener group, which was basically peers that supported peers. And the group of peer listeners was itself very um diverse. So within the peer group that we had was very insightful, everything like the conversations that we uh had. We were trained together to be able to sustain conversations, support in any way of anything that peers might might needed. That helped me so much. And that for me was I think one of the best experiences I had because it allowed me to understand what actually listening is and how to listen and also how to be listened, and that it's important that you make yourself your voice heard. Um, so that like I think that's also why I understood that what you just described, right? Like understanding that we're more similar than we think um is the way around and it's how we should be living every day, especially if we live in international contexts or any place where diversity is is a thing.
SPEAKER_00Well and I I I appreciate you pointing out that um training, that you were actually trained, right? So so there is there are actual skills that maybe will come to us naturally, but probably won't. And so you actually benefited from some explicit skill building training as well.
unknownYeah.
SPEAKER_01Yes, yes. I feel very, very lucky.
SPEAKER_00Well, um, next question. Yeah, I mean, you've already shared a little bit about this, but uh if if you've got anything more, please share more, which is what is what's next for you?
SPEAKER_01Oh, I'm very excited for what's uh yet to come. My plan for the summer is to go back to Bolivia. Um I'm working with um a psychiatrist. And that it was I would say that it was one of my inspirations to do neuroscience. Um and he works at a place, it's called Intraid, it's in Spanish, it's basically a center where um people with addictions and any kind of mental disorder really go and they can they can live there for some time. They have a support system. Um well the head of this center is the psychiatrist that does research. And I want to work with him, so I'm I think I'm gonna go back to Bolivia, do that, um give a little bit back to Bolivia, see my family, see my friends, sort of center my career towards something very specific and try to try to I want to explore the possibilities that neuroscience has to offer. Really, you can do so much. Um there's the the cell biology track. I'm more leaning towards the behavioral side because I really like the way people behave, the way cultures are formed, the dynamics that we have. So I really want to follow that. And I think having the opportunity now in summer to expose myself to differences and new outcomes of life would be very, very insightful in what I want to do. And also working with a person that I have admired for so many years. Excellent. That sounds so exciting. Yes, I'm very oh, and also I'm I'm planning on going abroad. As I said, like after bread, something that I really wanted to do is to move around and I think to make uh the experience in university integral and just explore as much as I can going abroad and studying abroad for a semester is definitely something that I wanted to do soon. Um yeah, for after uni, I have no clue. I think we're gonna go get there soon.
SPEAKER_00Step by step, step by step. Yes. Uh do you know? Do you have any thoughts on where you would want to study abroad?
SPEAKER_01Yes, London. Fingers crossed. I want to go to London. Well, there are there are very very many reasons. Um I actually, after I realized that maybe the US was not only the option that I had for university, London was the second one. Um, I think it's a city that I thought reflected me and who I was. So I was like a couple of years ago, I was very into uh I really I really felt a lot of appeal by the weather, the way that the city is structured. I I was just very attracted to that. So I want to experience it. I don't want to like have lived without having experienced London as a city. But the program that the university offers in London, it's connected to some studies that I did before when I was in Armenia. I took theater in Armenia because also my curiosity had led me to so many things. Like I've tried so many things. So I did um theater when I was in Armenia, and I studied like a couple of um theater forms from London, one of those being Pantomime. And the program that I'm gonna take in London focuses on art and history, and theater is one of the components. And I really want to take advantage of the liberal arts approach approach of the university and just do something completely different. And if I'm not mistaken, I might end up with a minor in European studies, which is crazy. Uh so yeah, I think I think I also wanted to allow myself to do something that I didn't have to do because I had to do for the for my for my CV, for my for the major itself. I just wanted to do something completely different because I think that really reflects who I am. Uh and I think it's important to keep on honoring that I'm I'm like that.
SPEAKER_00Broad interests. I mean, yeah, I mean, you mentioned art in passing earlier on in our conversation, um, but we didn't explore it at all.
SPEAKER_01And now uh now you're uh thank you for sharing that uh about your plans for London as well, because that's a whole other aspect of your interests we hadn't even link it back to neuroscience because you're talking about the way that people express themselves and the people that and the way that people have understood their context and the people and the way that people have reflected different periods on time, which is directly linked to the dynamics that they had, the structures that they had, that again links back to the brain and how it's a structure and the things you learn and the things that the all of the sets that you have, the mental sets and the and the conclusions that your brain reaches, and why do they why does it do that? So again, behavioral neuroscience.
SPEAKER_00I love it. And also, it also seems to be a way that another way in which you're breaking down or questioning the boxes that we put people in, because you know, I think by default, we tend to think of you know neuroscience as part of STEM, and there's a certain left brain, you left brain people do STEM and right brain people do art. Well, not you, Nico. You're you you're you're not you're not allowing yourself to be lifted by those distinctions.
SPEAKER_01Right in the middle, I guess.
SPEAKER_00I don't know about that. I like I have a different metaphor. But I it's to me it's not it's not like um not not putting you on a line. It's like you encompass the whole thing.
SPEAKER_01That works for me too. All right, good, good, good.
SPEAKER_00That feels to me, that feels more like a more true reflection of of who you are.
SPEAKER_02Aaron Ross Powell I appreciate that.
SPEAKER_00The last question I have for you is so we live In a world that's full of suffering, and a lot of that suffering is caused by humans, and it can be easy to feel overwhelmed, it can be easy to lose hope. Have you got any words to encourage us about the future?
SPEAKER_01I think it's important to find hope within ourselves and to share that with the world. And the way that I personally practice that is I allow myself to have conversations with people that I've never seen before. Um, I smile a lot to people that just walk by my side. And for me, that it's like a level of happiness that I can't explain. And it's what whenever I'm walking and I see someone and I have the desire of smiling at them, and they smile back at me, I know that maybe their day is gonna be a bit better, and mine is gonna be also a bit better. Way better. I love smiling at people. Um yeah, that's just brought me so much hope. And having done Baret and having do it in so many places and realizing that people do like smiling back and do they they do feel fulfilled when when you when you do that. Or that's at least what I sensed. It's what that's what I try to do, and that's how I've been regaining hope. And and yeah, I think that's what keeps me hopeful every day to be able to have these little interactions that you normally wouldn't if you stay in that mental bubble of the people that you already know and the things that you already do.
SPEAKER_00That's such a beautiful that's uh there's there's so much in there. Yeah, I think what I'm left with is just the the power of the small, what might seem small, right, in our lives. It seems it might like a smile, one smile to one person might seem small, but it's not small at all. It's kind of like a lot of people. And I think the change starts there. Yes, yes.
SPEAKER_01It reminds you reminded me to Elena's video, the one that she did for Barette, the beauty in the small things, appreciating those small moments and those small interactions that in the end are the ones that mean the most.
SPEAKER_00Well, that's a beautiful note for us to end on. Is there anything else that you'd like to say before we wrap up?
SPEAKER_01I wanted to say thank you so much. I'm very happy that you are uh doing this. I think it's for us as the school as scholars, it's a great um archive to have having conversations with you and exploring what our experience was. I think it's something great you're doing. Thank you very much, Jason. Thank you for the space too.
SPEAKER_00You're welcome, Nico. And it's it is so utterly my pleasure and my honor. As I as I say in the in the the voiceover at the start of the pod, it's like the program ended, and I desperately wanted to stay in touch with you all. It's like, oh, you know, you all of you had been such an important part of my life for all of these months. Transformative months for me too. I learned and grew so much during this time together. Um, I'm just incredibly grateful for the opportunity to keep in touch with you all. And and I learn so much, and I'm so inspired by all of you. So thank you too, Nico.
SPEAKER_01I hope we can see each other soon. Maybe I go to California, visit you, Belen.
SPEAKER_00That would be great. Yeah, actually, I just I just ended up interviewing Belen for the pod yesterday.
SPEAKER_01Wow. I'm gonna I'm gonna text her. That's a note for me to text her. Okay, great. Nice talking to you, Jason. Thank you very much again.
SPEAKER_00You're welcome, Nico. Nice talking to you too. I hope you enjoyed my conversation with Nico. If you did, please tell at least one friend about it. Give us a five star rating and follow the podcast. That will help others find us. Until next time, let's keep our heads clear and our hearts open.